Comments on: All Furniture Was Not Made In America http://rarevictorian.com/2008/05/all-furniture-was-not-made-in-america.html The definitive Victorian antique furniture destination Tue, 02 Dec 2008 01:06:37 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=abc By: drew49 http://rarevictorian.com/2008/05/all-furniture-was-not-made-in-america.html#comment-241 drew49 Thu, 15 May 2008 13:24:35 +0000 http://rarevictorian.com/?p=365#comment-241 Hi! I might add that I have often been tempted to think that certain pieces are British in origin when they are American with UK-style design elements. (Example-some late Victorian oak pieces with A/C brass decorations or some Aesthetic-style pieces.) Thanks!<p class="top-comments">Current score: <span class="top-comments-karma" id="karma-241">0</span> <small>(to vote for this comment, please visit the site)</small></p> Hi!
I might add that I have often been tempted to think that certain pieces are British in origin when they are American with UK-style design elements. (Example-some late Victorian oak pieces with A/C brass decorations or some Aesthetic-style pieces.)
Thanks!

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]]> By: RareVictorian http://rarevictorian.com/2008/05/all-furniture-was-not-made-in-america.html#comment-240 RareVictorian Thu, 15 May 2008 11:33:54 +0000 http://rarevictorian.com/?p=365#comment-240 Drew, Yes, <a href="http://www.victorianforum.com/index.php?topic=223.msg795#msg795" rel="nofollow">the "Roux" chair</a> is a glaring example. He must have taken up the Dutch language at some point ;-) Zeke, Thanks for the pointer on the secondary. I knew there would be a distinction to be found there. Thanks for the tip. Woodright, yes, the tiles don't guarantee origin due to the free flow of decorative elements between Europe and U.S. back then (plaques, tiles, etc.). In my view, they seem to have been employed more freely in the UK than they were in America. I don't think an American furniture maker would ever think to slap some tiles on an otherwise "normal" RR bookcase. On this piece they almost look out of place.<p class="top-comments">Current score: <span class="top-comments-karma" id="karma-240">0</span> <small>(to vote for this comment, please visit the site)</small></p> Drew, Yes, the “Roux” chair is a glaring example. He must have taken up the Dutch language at some point ;-)

Zeke, Thanks for the pointer on the secondary. I knew there would be a distinction to be found there. Thanks for the tip.

Woodright, yes, the tiles don’t guarantee origin due to the free flow of decorative elements between Europe and U.S. back then (plaques, tiles, etc.). In my view, they seem to have been employed more freely in the UK than they were in America. I don’t think an American furniture maker would ever think to slap some tiles on an otherwise “normal” RR bookcase. On this piece they almost look out of place.

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]]> By: woodwright http://rarevictorian.com/2008/05/all-furniture-was-not-made-in-america.html#comment-239 woodwright Thu, 15 May 2008 04:36:46 +0000 http://rarevictorian.com/?p=365#comment-239 The strap hinges on this bookcase look British, and have an Arts & Crafts style to them. The stepped crown w/ the 3 inset tiles is also an unusual detail. Take these 2 design elements away and it would look like a lot of other 4 door American Walnut Rennaisance Revival bookcases. Minton or Minton Hollins (of the UK) was the most renown & prolific 19th century tile manufacturer. These tiles may or may not be Minton - I don't know for sure. Minton also had American distributors for their tiles - see the following photos of a Minton tile display @ the 1876 Centennial Exhibit in Philadelphia which are labeled "Minton Tiles", but if you look at the displays they have a New York and Philadelphia business name and address on them (to zoom in hold down the Ctrl key on the keyboard and roll the mouse wheel forward). http://libwww.library.phila.gov/CenCol/Details.cfm?ItemNo=c011470&sourceURL=subjcapsrch3.cfm&subjQueryKind=contains&subject=minton&capQueryKind=begwith&CaptionTitle=Minton%27s%20Tiles also http://libwww.library.phila.gov/CenCol/Details.cfm?ItemNo=c012917&sourceURL=subjcapsrch3.cfm&subjQueryKind=contains&subject=minton&capQueryKind=begwith&CaptionTitle=Minton%20Tiles also http://libwww.library.phila.gov/CenCol/Details.cfm?ItemNo=c020783&sourceURL=subjcapsrch3.cfm&subjQueryKind=contains&subject=minton&capQueryKind=begwith&CaptionTitle=Minton%20Tiles Another point to ponder is: The Ebonized Brunswick pool table (just recently featured here on RareVictorian - for sale this weekend @ Bob Courtney's auction) http://cgi.liveauctions.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&viewitem=&item=180231550846 has 2 minton tiles built into it - 1 on each end. I spoke w/ Mark Stellinga (owner of this pool table) a while ago about it and asked him how he knew they were Minton tiles. He replied that the tiles were removed during the restoration and are stamped Minton on the back side (as most if not all Minton tiles are). I have since also seen the exact same Minton tiles for sale on ebay in different colors marked Minton. This table is unmistakeably made in the US by Brunswick, and definately has Minton tiles made in the UK. My point is that even if it has tiles from the UK is not enough to prove that it was made in the UK. Certainly there were a lot of European craftsman making furniture, but the Atlantic Ocean is a formidable barrier that would have been costly to overcome, particularly for large/ heavy pieces of furniture. Although today there are a fair number of importers bringing large/ impressive pieces of european furniture to the US market in containers. woodwright<p class="top-comments">Current score: <span class="top-comments-karma" id="karma-239">0</span> <small>(to vote for this comment, please visit the site)</small></p> The strap hinges on this bookcase look British, and have an Arts & Crafts style to them. The stepped crown w/ the 3 inset tiles is also an unusual detail. Take these 2 design elements away and it would look like a lot of other 4 door American Walnut Rennaisance Revival bookcases.
Minton or Minton Hollins (of the UK) was the most renown & prolific 19th century tile manufacturer. These tiles may or may not be Minton - I don’t know for sure. Minton also had American distributors for their tiles - see the following photos of a Minton tile display @ the 1876 Centennial Exhibit in Philadelphia which are labeled “Minton Tiles”, but if you look at the displays they have a New York and Philadelphia business name and address on them (to zoom in hold down the Ctrl key on the keyboard and roll the mouse wheel forward). http://libwww.library.phila.gov/CenCol/Details.cfm?ItemNo=c011470&sourceURL=subjcapsrch3.cfm&subjQueryKind=contains&subject=minton&capQueryKind=begwith&CaptionTitle=Minton%27s%20Tiles also http://libwww.library.phila.gov/CenCol/Details.cfm?ItemNo=c012917&sourceURL=subjcapsrch3.cfm&subjQueryKind=contains&subject=minton&capQueryKind=begwith&CaptionTitle=Minton%20Tiles also http://libwww.library.phila.gov/CenCol/Details.cfm?ItemNo=c020783&sourceURL=subjcapsrch3.cfm&subjQueryKind=contains&subject=minton&capQueryKind=begwith&CaptionTitle=Minton%20Tiles
Another point to ponder is: The Ebonized Brunswick pool table (just recently featured here on RareVictorian - for sale this weekend @ Bob Courtney’s auction) http://cgi.liveauctions.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&viewitem=&item=180231550846 has 2 minton tiles built into it - 1 on each end. I spoke w/ Mark Stellinga (owner of this pool table) a while ago about it and asked him how he knew they were Minton tiles. He replied that the tiles were removed during the restoration and are stamped Minton on the back side (as most if not all Minton tiles are). I have since also seen the exact same Minton tiles for sale on ebay in different colors marked Minton. This table is unmistakeably made in the US by Brunswick, and definately has Minton tiles made in the UK. My point is that even if it has tiles from the UK is not enough to prove that it was made in the UK. Certainly there were a lot of European craftsman making furniture, but the Atlantic Ocean is a formidable barrier that would have been costly to overcome, particularly for large/ heavy pieces of furniture. Although today there are a fair number of importers bringing large/ impressive pieces of european furniture to the US market in containers. woodwright

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